Where are the good old days?

acw · Jun 5, 2005

I have been complaining about this before:
http://forum.therx.com/showthread.php?t=139185

Lets start with this Dutch match!
Back in 1999 we had this match between Bulgaria and England:
http://www.soccerbase.com/results3.sd?gameid=420588

I can remember very well that in Asia the handicap moved from England giving 1/2 goal to 1 goal. Yes, England playing away had to give 1 full goal. Obviously that was a huge bet on Bulgaria (after which the bookie run away, but that is another story). Now, England is/was not better than the Dutch team and what is the difference between Bulgaria and Roumania? Both East European teams. I consider them equally strong. So now Holland does not play away but at home against one of those East European teams and only gives 1 goal?!?!? Yes, the price was right. Nothing to argue there, but in the old days this would have been 1.5 goals! (In which case I would have had a big bet on Roumania and LOST).

The biggest shocker yesterday was Liechtenstein. Yes, they have not been playing that bad of late, but still in this team you will find players that in daily life are bankers (non-professionals). And how many people live in Liechtenstein, Dick Delicious? Estonia should not be giving 1.25 goals? Should it not be 2 goals? Anyhow the market opened up 1.5 goals and I was hoping for it to move to 2, but again no luck (or luckely, because Estonia won 2-0) the market moved almost to 1 goal before I could do anything.

I am just curious. Anyone out there that has been betting on one of these outsiders?

fookineejit · Jun 5, 2005

The big move i noticed yesterday was on Albania. The price really dropped as kick-off approached.

I have not been backing these dogs but then again if i had it would barely be enough to move the line never mind the handicap.

Took Czech Republic -3.5 and -4 which was a nice earner, but lost it back today with Nigeria and Senegal underperforming in Africa.

DarrylParsons · Jun 6, 2005

acw,

I am no soccer expert but it seems Asians with their dog preference is dominating the markets these days. A European soccer punter friend of mine (who is no dumdum -- a chess grandmaster in fact (which doesn't guarantee not being a dumdum but in his case it works)) said that he likes to bet world cup preliminary matches because there is usually a lot of value on the favorites.

I didn't listen to him and I lost about 5k yesterday just picking off soft lines from sleepy Costa Rican shops (with obviously bad lines) but I got taken to the cleaners. My theory is the fricken Asians (meant lightly of course) bet down the dogs just on instinct and since there are so many of them, the value went the other way.

Any thoughts on my theory?

acw · Jun 6, 2005

I am no soccer expert but it seems Asians with their dog preference is dominating the markets these days.
It is very wrong to say that the Asians have a dog preference. Much better to refer to the Asian market, as plenty of non-Asians bet into it. According to my analyses there is no bias in the Asian market. Not at all! The market is frustratingly accurate these days. Western bookies do get more money on the favourites and that is why you are likely to get much better prices on the favourites in Asia than elsewhere. Also the lower vig helps.

I lost about 5k yesterday just picking off soft lines from sleepy Costa Rican shops
You are still doing the right thing.

but I got taken to the cleaners.
On which teams did you bet and where?

DarrylParsons · Jun 6, 2005

Upon closer inspection it looks like the dogs 0.5-1.5 were nowhere near as bad as the totals, which went 1-8!

The dogs were Iceland + .25 and Georgia +.75 (only half loss)

The totals that lost were:

Lithuania over 2.5
Kazakh over 3
San Marino Under 3
Georgia Under 3
Holland Over 2.5
Serbia Over 2.5
Faroe Under 3
Czech Under 4.5

The one winner was Norway Under 2.5 -- WOOHOO!

The bets were made at CRIS, Mansion and Pinnacle...I know Mansion and Pinnacle are not Costa Rican but their lines were way off from the Asian ones and very juicy...scalps or middles were available with Pointbet but I don't do those...instead I just bet on what I think is the wrong line and hope for the best. Well this time it didn't work out :increible

acw · Jun 6, 2005

The dogs were Iceland + .25 and Georgia +.75 (only half loss)
You are making a joke!
Iceland closed +1/4 in Asia, so no edge there.
Georgia ended +1, so you were simply on the wrong side!

I do not have the closing prices on the totals.

scalps or middles were available with Pointbet
These guys are often in Asia off!

matahari · Jun 6, 2005

scalps or middles were available with Pointbet These guys are often in Asia off!

Since a long time in fact. Do you have any updates about them, acw ?

fookineejit · Jun 6, 2005

I have taken them to the cleaners just lately. They are paying like clockwork (so far, knock on wood etc.)

acw · Jun 6, 2005

Do you have any updates about them, acw ?
No, except for the fact that they will not let me play with them.

matahari · Jun 6, 2005

No, except for the fact that they will not let me play with them.

Why not ? Even into someone other's name they recognize you ?

acw · Jun 7, 2005

Why not ?
I gave them my European identity, then they got paranoid, when I started chatting with one of their helpdesk agents in Indonesian. They wanted me to scan the details page of my passport and email it to them. When they asked me for this, I did not have a scanner yet (I do now), so I told them that I wanted to fax it to them. Since they refused to give me a fax no. and insisted on the fact that I had to scan it and email to them, my account never got opened.

Indosport gives these guys only 1/10 credit of what I get from them. It should not say much about my credibility, but more about theirs. As I have been saying so often and fookin eejit kind of confirms it, I never heard of any no pays, but one must remain cautious!

matahari · Jun 7, 2005

acw,

I have heard that of now they operate out of Bantam island, which is an Indonesian special economic zone just offshore Singapore and that they supposedly moved out of Jakarta after a police crackdown on them there. Gossip or true story ?

acw · Jun 8, 2005

matahari,

I heard similar gossip, but I cannot confirm any of it.

acw · Aug 17, 2005

fookin eejit said:
I have taken them to the cleaners just lately. They are paying like clockwork (so far, knock on wood etc.)

You may want to get out of them NOW:
14.08.2005 (22:51 CST)
SBR Bill Dozer reports: SBR receives multiple complaints from Pointbet (SBR rating D+) customers. The majority of these complaints are regarding a lack of email responses and website down-time. One player reports being locked out of his account, which holds a four figure balance, for what has now been three weeks.

"My account has been frozen for more than two weeks. I have sent numerous e-mails to care@pointbet.com. My e-mails have been completely ignored. The message I receive is as follows: "Your account is being frozen. Please contact care@Pointbet.com" Please turn my account back on and explain why this has happened."

Personally I am happy that this is happening. Their prices were just too good. And God, it hurts to see those prices and not taking any benefit from them.

koshka · Aug 18, 2005

acw, is it dangerous to play with Pointbet right now? Do they profit or loose money? Can you name good online asian handicap bookmakers?

acw · Jul 7, 2006

koshka said:
acw, is it dangerous to play with Pointbet right now?

YES

07.05.2006 (10:23 PM CST)
SBR Bill Dozer reports: Pointbet (SBR rating D+) payout delays expand to both of the book’s available payout options. After waiting a week for Moneybookers withdrawals, due to an underfunded merchant account, some players have requested their funds by bank wire. These bank wire transfers have been pending for one week and have not yet been paid.

These Asian books have been taken completely to the cleaners during this World Cup. Squares and Sharps have been winning and winning. Only losers that I know of so far are the books.

ensign_lee · Jul 7, 2006

Response A little outdated?

Duckstabber · Jul 7, 2006

ensign_lee said:
Response A little outdated?

Why?

I was actually going to re-up at Pointbet for the upcoming season but I guess I won't do that after all.

dj_mercury · Jul 8, 2006

acw said:
YES

These Asian books have been taken completely to the cleaners during this World Cup. Squares and Sharps have been winning and winning. Only losers that I know of so far are the books.

but they are not the only book offering asian handicap, what about 10bet? The blackboard odds offered by Pointbet is similar as the one offered by "underground" Asian bookies, so their price are not too good, they are following similar bookies but they are offering these odds to the whole market and not to a restricted number of costumers.